In this lesson
Jacques Lee Wood joins Simon Powis with a cello in hand to discuss Bach’s cello suites. His experience with both modern and period instruments provides a perspective that guitarists can miss when they encounter these works only through guitar editions and recordings.
The demonstrations are central to the episode. These notes provide listening points for hearing differences in character, articulation and harmonic direction, while recognising that Wood is presenting an interpretive approach rather than the only permissible way to play Bach.
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Originally published in 2018. These listening notes draw on the recorded conversation. Roles, projects, releases and event announcements refer to the time of recording. Practical reflections are suggested applications, not additional quotations from the guest.
Explore the conversation
Use these approximate timestamps to jump to a topic in the recording.
- 10:31 — The original instrument raises useful musical questions
- 25:02 — Speech offers a different model from continuous singing
- 31:07 — Different movements need different characters
- 34:29 — Articulation should inform fingering choices
- 40:02 — Harmony gives a phrase emotional direction
- 37:56 — Musical flexibility develops through repeated reconsideration
The original instrument raises useful musical questions
Wood distinguishes the physical and musical possibilities of modern and Baroque cello setups. The bow influences the beginning, development and ending of a note, and therefore the kind of phrase that feels natural to the player.
For a guitarist, the purpose of this discussion is not to reproduce a cello mechanically. It is to understand the musical gestures behind an arrangement and decide how the guitar can communicate them.
Listen to a cello performance before finalising your guitar fingering. Notice which notes are grouped, where an articulation creates a boundary and how a phrase seems to breathe. Those observations can become questions to explore on your own instrument.
Speech offers a different model from continuous singing
“You cannot separate style and Bach style and technique.”
— Jacques Lee Wood, 26:48
Wood uses the distinction between recitative and aria to explain his approach. Speech-like music contains changing emphasis, lighter syllables and punctuation. A continuously connected singing style can produce a different result.
He demonstrates how changes in shape can bring life to a passage that otherwise sounds evenly executed. His suggestions are starting points for hearing direction, not mechanical instructions to apply identically to every rising or falling line.
A useful experiment is to speak a short sentence and notice its unequal stresses. Then play a small phrase with a comparable sense of direction. The goal is an audible relationship between notes, not exaggerated accents on every beat.
Different movements need different characters
Wood compares passages that can lose their individuality when played through the same consistently smooth, beautiful sound. Attention to dance character, metre and articulation gives each movement a more distinct identity.
He also acknowledges that another style of playing can be beautiful. His preference for a particular approach is not presented as proof that every other interpretation is wrong.
For a student learning more than one movement, describe the character of each before practising. Compare their pulse, gesture and mood. If the descriptions are identical, listen again for what might distinguish them.
Articulation should inform fingering choices
The conversation examines the difference between connected scalar motion and larger intervals. Bowing offers a cellist one set of tools; the guitarist has slurs, note lengths, string choices and positions.
Simon connects this with the need to choose fingerings for a musical purpose. A fingering printed in an edition is a proposal, and another solution may better express the articulation you want.
Try two versions of a short passage and record them. Listen for continuity, separation and changes of colour. The easier physical option may be right, but it is useful to know what musical difference accompanies the choice.
Harmony gives a phrase emotional direction
Wood highlights dissonance and the implied bass as points of interest in the suites. Even when the texture is largely a single line, harmony shapes where the music feels settled and where it presses forward.
The demonstrations invite listeners to hear more than a succession of equally important notes. An arrival can gain meaning from the tension that precedes it.
In your own excerpt, locate one moment of tension and the place where it resolves. Play through that relationship before adding more detail. A clear harmonic direction can organise a phrase that otherwise feels like a long technical exercise.
Musical flexibility develops through repeated reconsideration
“things change all the time”
— Jacques Lee Wood, 38:01
Wood describes performance as an activity that always requires adjustment. Experience does not eliminate changing conditions or the need to respond to another musician, an instrument or a room.
That flexibility also applies to interpretation. New understanding can lead to a revised fingering or a different articulation after a piece already feels familiar.
The interview’s practical value lies in opening those possibilities. Return to one familiar Bach passage with a single new question, then listen for whether the resulting change makes its character clearer.
Ideas to take into your own music
These prompts are reflections on the conversation, rather than a routine prescribed by the guest.
- Hear the source instrument: compare a cello performance with your guitar version.
- Give movements distinct characters: describe their different gestures and moods.
- Choose fingering for a reason: compare the articulation produced by two options.
- Trace tension and release: hear a phrase through its harmonic direction.
Original episode notes and resources
The original introduction and resources are retained below. Any time-sensitive announcements belong to the episode’s publication period.
In this episode, Simon sits down with cellist Dr. Jacques Lee Wood to discuss J. S. Bach’s Cello Suites. This is a
fascinating discussion focusing on the importance of quality of voice, dynamics, Baroque style versus a flatter modern style of playing, and much, much more.
J. S. Bach’s Six Suites for Unaccompanied Cello were likely written around the same time he wrote his sonatas and partitas for the unaccompanied violin. However, no manuscript exists in Bach’s own hand so many details about the suites come from various manuscripts, including one important manuscript by his wife, Anna Magdalena. In this episode Jacques walks through passages from several of the suites, especially Suite no. 1 (in G Major) and Suite no. 3 (in C Major).
As a bonus for listeners is a superb recording of Simon’s arrangement of “L’Heure Exquisse” by Reynaldo Hahn for guitar and cello, performed by Simon and Jacques. This is a touching piece that has profound personal meaning for Simon and one I think you’ll all enjoy.
Dr. Jacques Lee Wood (DMA, Yale University) is an in-demand teacher and performer located in Boston, Massachusetts in the United States. Jacques performs in many chamber groups, including Antico Modern, a period chamber ensemble that commissions new works for period instruments, and StringLab, a duo with Simon Powis, and is a guest artist in many music festivals and venues all over the world. He is also a principal player with the Grammy-nominated Trinity Baroque Orchestra, Bachsolisten Seoul, the American Baroque Orchestra. You’ll also hear Jacques playing with the NYC-based modern bluegrass group Cathedral Parkway, playing mandolin, cello, and banjo (of which Simon is also a founding member).

I loved this podcast. I would love to hear more of these type of podcasts that are analysis of famous pieces. One of your older podcasts where you analyzed the Rossini operas and your playing if it was also great. I also think Simon, that you should bring your mom on the podcast. :-). Make it a podcast about the perspective of a parent of a musician if she’s not a musician herself. Hehehe
Thank you for a great podcast. I was fascinated by this one perhaps especially because I am so familiar with Bach’s first suite for cello.
I also love cello music!
Those general concepts to keep in mind when playing this music will be very useful.
Thanks, Simon, for the stunning duet and very interesting discussion. I sent the link to my son who is interested in cello. Maybe some day…!
-Jeff
Simon,
I listened to this podcast with fascination. It was very interesting. It also raised a few questions that I would like to ask…
Relative to old style/new style (but with guitar pieces):
When I first learned the Carcassi Etudes I used a book with fingerings by Miguel Llobet. As far as I can tell, this book is no longer even in print. When I compare the versions of pieces in your Level 3 book to the old Llobet book there are some differences, usually minor, but differences. How much of this is dependent on the fact that tastes change? Do fingerings for pieces like this evolve with the times?
Relative to “Etudes”:
When describing playing several of the Bach pieces, Dr. Wood uses the phrase “just an etude,” in a somewhat disparaging context. I had never heard this before and, as someone knee deep in a variety of etudes, I am wondering if there is some further reading you could recommend to dive a bit deeper into this.
Thanks for a very thought-provoking podcast.
Richard
Hi Richard,
I do think indeed that fingerings evolve. Take some famous examples from Segovia’s masterful editions. He had a particular way of fingering that fit his own playing style and interpretation, but it also fit a particular time and cultural heritage. Many people have respectfully taken a different approach with some of the famous Segovia repertoire and would choose their own fingerings that divert heavily from Segovia’s (and perhaps from those other giants of his time and before his time like Llobet and Tarrega).
I won’t speak for Jacques on that comment but I think what he meant was not to disparage etudes necessarily, but to call into question the approach that makes Bach’s music into more of a technical exercise with one dynamic and not paying special attention to phrases or the variety of dance structure, and so on. I hope that helps explain that comment a bit better…but again, I can’t speak for Jacques here!
Thanks for the comment, Richard.
Peace,
Dave B (CGC team)
Dave,
Thank you. I sometimes wonder about how styles change. I can hear it by dipping into Spotify and listening to recordings made in the 50s and 60s and comparing them to the same pieces played in more recent recordings. Obviously there are differences because of the performer, but there are also trends that seem to track across decades. I had never thought of this as applying to things like fingerings until I listened to this podcast and some of what Dr. Wood had said.
Cheers,
RIchard
Excellent discussion of Bach cello suites. Very helpful! Reminded me of the session with Koonce — also excellent.
Suggestion: can you find a lutenist to discuss the lute suites? And going down that road: how about a podcast devoted to just the Chaconne?